印度的民族主义是什么（三）-pg电子麻将胡了
what is nationalism in india?译文简介
网友：理解民族主义——这是对自己国家的进步和自豪感的深厚感情：一个人必须知道什么构成了一个国家。以下是我对一个国家的理解：国家：是指一大群人因共同的血统、历史、文化或语言而联合在一起，居住在一个特定的邦或地区......
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what is nationalism in india?
印度的民族主义是什么
印度的民族主义是什么
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what is the basis of india's nationalism ?
to understand nationalism ~ a profound feeling for betterment and pride for ones nation : one must know the meaning of what constitutes a nation. so here is my understanding of a nation:
nation ?ne??(?)n/ : is a large body of people united by common descent, history, culture or language, inhabiting a particular state or territory. it is derived from latin natio meaning : people, tribe, kinsmen etc.
uk a small country has 4 nations namely : english, irish, scottish and welsh. but there is a fine commonality which makes them british.
in layman terms, it is a large group of people bound together by some common interests like collective security, military power (now a days used as a last resort), currency to ease & control economic activities, favourable balance of trade, etc.
for such purposes, some strong & wealthy people with the help of some shrewd & intelligent people of olden days would come together and form kingdoms.
印度民族主义的基础是什么？
要理解民族主义——这是对自己国家的进步和自豪感的深厚感情：一个人必须知道什么构成了一个国家。以下是我对一个国家的理解：
国家：是指一大群人因共同的血统、历史、文化或语言而联合在一起，居住在一个特定的邦或地区。它源自拉丁语“natio”的意思：人、部落、亲属等。
英国是一个由4个国家组成的国家，即：英格兰、爱尔兰、苏格兰和威尔士。但有一个使他们成为英国人的共通性。
通俗地说，它是一大群人，他们被一些共同的利益联系在一起，如集体安全、军事力量（现在是最后手段）、货币宽松的政策和控制经济活动的货币、有利的贸易平衡等。
为了这些目的，一些强大而富有的人会在一些精明而聪明的古代人的帮助下走到一起，组成王国。
the common religion earlier called sanatan, was established over most of these areas.
due to excesses by the ruling & adviser classes, the 4 varna system & many other tyrannical systems were challenged by buddhism & jainism both these religious ideologies gathered some followership but since they distributed the existing feudal system the advisor class (all powers, no fear because it is an indelible sin to kill one of them & no responsibility, if they adultr or kill then they just go on a long vacation to bathe in ganga to wash off the sins) so these advisors ceaselessly connived with the ruling class to suppress the new social revolutions.
众所周知，在英国人精明无情地建立印度之前，没有一个地方叫印度的。然而，一些很少有历史学家不知疲倦地试图用确凿证据来支持的神话故事说，巴拉特皇帝统治了今天的巴基斯坦、印度大部分地区和缅甸。
早期被称为sanatan的共同宗教在这些地区的大部分地区建立起来。
由于统治阶级和顾问阶级的过度行为，4瓦尔纳等级体系和许多其他专制体系都受到了佛教和耆那教的挑战，这两种宗教意识形态都聚集了一些追随者，但由于他们分散了现有的封建体系，即顾问阶层（独揽大权，没有恐惧，因为杀死他们中的一个是不可磨灭的罪恶&没有责任，如果他们通奸或杀人，他们就会去恒河渡假，洗去罪孽）所以这些顾问不断地与统治阶级勾结，镇压新社会革命。
after the death of ashok and bimbisar, the upper class succeeded in almost routing out the rising stars of these social revolutions.
some brilliant saints across the country, constantly endeavoured to improve the clawed feudal system. these least violent yet ceaseless struggles between the socio-cultural classes : mostly lead by saints , is the common thread that makes all of us belonging to a common-culture. the mughal & the muslim rulers, being successfully challenged by the likes of shivaji maharaj and peshwe was loved by 85% non-muslims of india. this history of successful hindu kings too makes the same 85% feel proud.
后来，旃多罗岌多(chandragupta maurya)皇帝和阿育王也控制了上述领土的大部分。
在阿育王和bimbisarn国王去世后，上层阶级几乎成功地将这些社会革命的新星淘汰出局。
全国各地一些杰出的圣人，不断为完善封建制度而奋斗。这些社会文化阶级之间最不暴力却又无休止的斗争：主要由圣徒领导，存在的共同点使我们所有人都属于一个共同的文化。莫卧儿和穆斯林统治者受到shivaji maharaj和 peshwe等人的成功挑战，他们受到85%的印度非穆斯林的喜爱。印度国王的成功历史也让85%的印度人感到自豪。
the constitution written by dr. ambedkar that endeavours to do justice to all, specially the weak & the downtrodden; our constitution that all indians especially the politicians promise to uphold always and every time.. is the uppermost entity that legally binds us together as indians.
many well identified symbols, like our national anthem, national flag, national teams they all bind-us together as indians.
尼赫鲁-圣雄甘地二人组成功地获得了大多数印度人对印度自由斗争的支持。这也极大地促进了我们的民族主义。只是尼赫鲁不是一个真诚的人，他太害怕自己的将军了，他通常会因为最糟糕的政策而让95%的印度人目瞪口呆，尤其是在教育和创业发展方面。由于我们所有印度人都遭受了痛苦，并盲目地遵循了他的、英迪拉和拉吉夫的愚蠢政策，这些政策旨在通过军火交易和许可证制度暗中赚取无数卢比和控制花费的政策。我们一起受苦，我们作为一个国家站在一起。
安贝德卡尔博士撰写的宪法，致力于公正对待所有人，尤其是弱者和受压迫者;我们的宪法，所有印度人，尤其是政客，承诺永远维护，它是在法律上将我们作为印度人联系在一起的最高实体。
许多公认的象征，比如我们的国歌、国旗、国家队，它们都将我们作为印度人联系在一起。
原创翻译：龙腾网 http://www.ltaaa.cn 转载请注明出处
is india peace loving nation ?
india is world's largest importer of arms and weapons, and yet it has never attacked or invaded any country, neither had any colonies.
we are world's largest democracy with all kinds of provisions and benefits to every minority section of the society.
we are the world's only nation with around 80% hindu population, divided into so many castes and sub castes. there are always issues no doubt, but still we have been going strong and united in need of hour!
印度是爱好和平的国家吗？
印度是世界上最大的武器进口国，但它从未袭击或入侵过任何国家，也没有任何殖民地。
我们是世界上最大的民主国家，为社会的每一个少数群体提供了各种食品和福利。
我们是世界上唯一一个拥有80%左右印度教人口的国家，分为许多种姓和子种姓。毫无疑问，总会有一些问题，但我们仍然很强大，毕竟团结需要时间！
do you think that india may lose its nationalism?
yes i think so
lets see how…
this word nationalism is being used these days, instead of practicing actually.
first politician tries to impose on our mind to play the game. they show us some form of pseudo nationalism that they do to use us. we believe and follow the same. and then we start seeing things as per nationalism window and try to define it with people place and things. and that's where this word actually loose the value and is used by some pseudo to categorise people and defame them.
你认为印度可能会失去民族主义吗？
是的，我想是有可能的
让我们看看如何失去的：
“民族主义”这个词现在被使用，而不是实际被践行。
首先，政治家试图强迫我们去玩这个游戏。他们向我们展示了某种形式的伪民族主义，他们这样做是为了利用我们。我们相信并遵循同样的原则。然后我们开始从民族主义的角度看待事物，并试图用人、地方和事物来定义它。这就是这个词失去价值的地方，被一些伪君子用来对人进行分类和诽谤。
see if you just utter a mere word for this country and you call yourself a nationalistic then it could be a mockery to define it. and leave this for politicians they are expert doing this.
we people better support each other and unite so that we can fight against the forces which are acting against us , against india. do not get fooled by wrong definition(based on religion and caste) that politicians do just for their own gain. because we now it better when we meet a person from other religion and caste how good they are to us and this is india(strong with diversity, indeed an example to other countries).
它应该是一种团结的感情，以反对内部和外部因素对我们社会和经济结构的破坏。它应该与国家的进步保持一致。民族主义的想法和看到印度在世界上名列前茅的想法没有什么不同。但在这里，我们可以看到围绕民族主义的内部斗争，这就是为什么这种虚假的民族主义削弱了民族主义的实际意义，这就是我认为我们正在失去民族主义的原因。
看看，只要你为这个国家说一句话，就称自己是民族主义者，那么给它下定义就是一种嘲弄。把这个留给政治家吧，他们是这方面的专家。
我们人民更好地相互支持，团结起来，这样我们就可以与反对我们、反对印度的势力作斗争。不要被错误的定义(基于宗教和种姓)所愚弄，政客们只是为了自己的利益而这么做。因为当我们遇到来自其他宗教和种姓的人时，我们会觉得他们对我们有多好，这就是印度(极具多样性，确实是其它国家的榜样)。
are you a nationalist in india?
yes. this means that i believe in the idea of india that is derived from our cherished freedom struggle.
i believe that for the well being of people in the sub-continent, we need the nation state of republic of india to thrive according to the timeless wisdom enshrined in its constitution.
i want it to be the way our founding fathers wanted it to be. a sovereign, socialist, secular, democratic, republic, acting as a welfare state in the best interests of the people of india.
this also means that i reject all forms of parochial, chauvinistic, cultural nationalism that is touted as an alternative to the idea of india.
communal or cultural nationalisms doesn't work for diverse countries. in a super diverse country like india, it would be a disaster to pursue any kind of cultural nationalism.
so by extension, cultural nationalisms of any kind are antithetical to the idea of india
你是印度的民族主义者吗？
是的。这意味着我相信印度的理念，这种理念源于我们珍视的自由斗争。
我认为，为了次大陆人民的福祉，我们需要印度这个民族国家按照其宪法中所载的永恒智慧蓬勃发展。
我希望它能像我们的开国元勋们所希望的那样。一个主权的、社会主义的、非宗教的、民主的、共和国，作为一个符合印度人民最大利益的福利国家。
这也意味着我拒绝一切形式的狭隘、沙文主义和文化民族主义，这些民族主义被吹捧为印度思想的替代品。
社群或文化民族主义不适用于多元化的国家。在印度这样一个超级多样化的国家，追求任何形式的文化民族主义都将是一场灾难。
因此，从广义上讲，任何形式的文化民族主义都与印度的理念背道而驰。
why are most of the indians devoid of nationalism?
i do not think that indians are devoid of nationalism.
why?
because
there are million of people working diligently in their positions in government/public and private sectors without any expectations. are they devoid of nationalism?
lakhs of medical/para-medical staff, cleaning staff, police, bankers and people from financial services have worked ceaselessly, diligently during the last five months with real threat to their lives. are they devoid of nationalism?
lakhs of good samaritans and organisations have sheltered and fed hungry, shelter less migrant labor without expecting anything in return. not even recognition. are they devoid of nationalism?
为什么大多数印度人没有民族主义？
我不认为印度人缺乏民族主义。
为什么？
因为：
有无数人在政府/公共和私营部门的岗位上辛勤工作，没有任何期望，他们是否缺乏民族主义？
在过去的五个月中，数以万计的医务/辅助医务人员、清洁人员、警察、银行家和金融服务人员在生命受到真正威胁的情况下不懈努力地工作。他们缺乏民族主义吗?
数以万计的好心人和组织在没有任何回报的情况下为饥饿、无住所的移民劳工提供庇护和食物。甚至没有得到认可，他们是否缺乏民族主义？
and yes, 20 bravehearts laid down their lives in galwan are these people devoid of nationalism?
i have only given some examples. consider it only indicative and not exhaustive. please feel free to add to the answer per your thoughts.
if you disagree with my thoughts then please blame my inadequacies to explain properly. but believe me, there is no dearth of nationalism in indians. probably we do not wear it on our sleeves like some.
这个拥有13亿人口的国家(很抱歉，塔鲁尔先生没有给出印度人的确切数字，因为我不知道确切的数字)没有挨饿，供应链在没有独裁统治的情况下运行得相当顺利。是机器人在管理岗位吗?我不这么认为。这些人没有民族主义吗?
还有就是20名勇敢的人在加勒万河谷献出了自己的生命，这些人是不是没有民族主义？
我只举了一些例子。认为它只是指示性的，而不是详尽无遗的。请随时根据你的想法添加答案。
如果你不同意我的想法，那就怪我解释得不够好。但相信我，印度人并不缺乏民族主义。也许我们不像有些人那样把它挂在袖子上。
how toxic is indian nationalism?
indian nationalism these days is based on a sense of victimhood, with different people claiming to be oppressed at some time or another…so that kind of nationalism is definitely toxic across the board.
so hindu right wing claims it was oppressed by nehru, and by the british and the muslims and so on…
nationalism has good and bad aspects. there are two kinds of bad nationalism…triumphalism, i.e. because england, usa, ussr had these successes, all it did was right, correct and moral. this is bad, but this is still healthier than the victim nationalism you see in india, in eastern europe and other parts of the world, because its all about vengeance, at righting past wrongs and all these kinds of evil vicarious emotions.
indian muslims in response to this kind of effect are forced to basically hold their tongues and prove that they are moderate and secular. it’s essentially uncle tom-ism
the real reason for these tensions is essentially the fact that the independence movement remains the foundational and representative event for indians. we never had an economic miracle, or a modernist 60s style cultural revolution in india which became a new reference point. so you still have the independence mentality of trying to form a national conciousness and ideal in india, but without the british as an enemy, they turn to other enemies among themselves. so that creates problems.
印度民族主义有多有害？
如今印度的民族主义是基于一种受害者意识，不同的人在不同的时间声称受到压迫，所以这种民族主义绝对是有害的
所以印度教右翼声称他们受到尼赫鲁、英国和穆斯林等等的压迫…
民族主义有好的方面也有糟糕的方面。有两种糟糕的民族主义，一种是必胜主义，即因为英国、美国、苏联取得了这些成功，他们所做的一切都是正确的、合适的和合乎道德的。这很糟糕，但这仍然比你在印度、东欧和世界其他地方看到的受害者的民族主义更健康，因为这都是为了复仇，为了纠正过去的错误，以及所有这些邪恶的替代情绪。
作为对这种影响的回应，印度穆斯林被迫基本上保持沉默，并证明他们是温和和非宗教的。这本质上是汤姆叔叔主义
这些紧张局势的真正原因本质上是独立运动仍然是印度人的基础和代表性事件。我们从未有过经济奇迹，印度也从没有经历过一场60年代现代主义风格的文化大革命，这成为新的参考点所以你仍然有独立的心态，试图在印度形成一种民族意识和理想，但如果没有英国人作为敌人，他们就会转向其他敌人，所以这就产生了问题。
what do british people think about india?
i am an indian who lived in britain for more than 10 years and this is what my manager who was english thought about india:
wondered why indians visit britain for holiday when india is the most beautiful place in the world.
thanks india for u.k.'s national food - chicken tikka massala
felt slumdog millionaire shouldn't have been made.
did not understand why bollywood has a lot of western style of music when we have such a rich traditional indian music.
英国人怎么看待印度？
我是一名印度人，在英国生活了10多年，这就是我的英国经理对印度的看法：
想知道印度本就是世界上最美丽的地方，为什么印度人还会来英国度假。
感谢印度为英国提供的国家美食——印度烤鸡咖喱
感觉《贫民窟的百万富翁》不应该被制作出来。
不明白为什么宝莱坞有很多西方风格的音乐，而印度原本就有非常丰富的传统印度音乐。